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Post by 4th Chord on Nov 29, 2020 11:38:03 GMT
We all know the views on Alan being replaced, the politics, the love/hate relationship fans had/have with Rhino (35 year veteran), but let's have a discussion purely about the music.
In a parallel universe, if the band had decided to go back to basics and the 'Quo' sound, but Francis just couldn't work with Al anymore, who could have stepped in to play bass/write songs and kept the world's greatest boogie band at the top of their game?
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Post by blagult on Nov 29, 2020 12:55:33 GMT
Which member Alan or Francis being replaced ? If Francis it’s a Difficult one. It wouldn’t be just about the music though. To me Francis with his stage presence as a front man, communicator with the fans is unequaled. I didn’t just fall in love with the music. It was the whole package and for me personally Francis was the whole package. He is one tough cookie to follow. But musically I’m not sure. For many fans though it would be someone who could have kept to capturing the Rock vibe I suppose. The Lead guy out of Georgia Satellites would have done a good job. Bass wise I don’t have a clue to be honest.
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Post by freewilly on Nov 29, 2020 13:02:33 GMT
No one!
Alan was Alan. He's one of few bass players I've heard with their own sound, purely from how he plays. His bass lines are pretty unique and creative too. Mystery Song being an example. LOAI, anyone could have came up with it but, the way he plays the notes add so much to the song that, if it was anyone else, the song would become so much less.
And that's before we get onto his vocals and stage presence.
For better or for worse, Alan feels like one of us. He's a Quo fan! Can't replace that. Can't replace any of them and I'm pretty certain John Edwards and Richie Malone would say the same thing
That's just my two cents
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Post by dennis on Nov 29, 2020 13:29:25 GMT
The reality is that the classic 4 man line up were unequalled at what they did for a few years in the early-mid '70s, very much a case of the band collectively being much more than the sum of it's individual parts - you could still feel a bit of that magic when they were reunited after 30 years. However, it's impossible to remain at that peak of creativity & performance indefinitely, & they had a bloody good run! Even after the addition of Andy they were still producing some good material in the late '70s & remained a fantastic live band, but nothing remains the same forever. People change as individuals, relationships change, & that's even before you get to consider actually replacing individual band members!
None of the line ups subsequent to John's departure from the band have generated much by way of recorded output of any note, although there have been a few exceptions along the way - increasingly fewer & farther between. So, they have mainly existed to perform predominantly classic era material live in order to maintain a fan base. Even on the EOTR tour in '84 there was nothing in the set post 1980, the set list was almost a monument to the '70-'80 output of the band - & good stuff it was too!
I don't think anybody can replace any of the original members in the full sense of being a creative, contributing member as it's nigh on impossible to recreate that magic that they had together. It's not a case of the quality of musicianship or talent, it's just that certain combinations work for a while & it's hard to recapture the essence of that experience once it's gone.
With better management I think the relationships in the band would have been much stronger & the need for line up changes could have been avoided.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Nov 29, 2020 15:04:06 GMT
The reality is that the classic 4 man line up were unequalled at what they did for a few years in the early-mid '70s, very much a case of the band collectively being much more than the sum of it's individual parts - you could still feel a bit of that magic when they were reunited after 30 years. However, it's impossible to remain at that peak of creativity & performance indefinitely, & they had a bloody good run! Even after the addition of Andy they were still producing some good material in the late '70s & remained a fantastic live band, but nothing remains the same forever. People change as individuals, relationships change, & that's even before you get to consider actually replacing individual band members! None of the line ups subsequent to John's departure from the band have generated much by way of recorded output of any note, although there have been a few exceptions along the way - increasingly fewer & farther between. So, they have mainly existed to perform predominantly classic era material live in order to maintain a fan base. Even on the EOTR tour in '84 there was nothing in the set post 1980, the set list was almost a monument to the '70-'80 output of the band - & good stuff it was too! I don't think anybody can replace any of the original members in the full sense of being a creative, contributing member as it's nigh on impossible to recreate that magic that they had together. It's not a case of the quality of musicianship or talent, it's just that certain combinations work for a while & it's hard to recapture the essence of that experience once it's gone. With better management I think the relationships in the band would have been much stronger & the need for line up changes could have been avoided. This sums up the situation perfectly, most classic bands have a classic line up, not necessarily the first line up as with Quo, but the combination of youthful energy and ambition and musical talent combines to create that indefinable magic. Once that line up alters by even one member it's not that the band has ceased to be good, it's just started to evolve along a new musical road, think of the massive change in styles with Purple and Whitesnake within very few years. Status Quo merely underwent the same process but fans of all long lived bands are nostalgic so the songs created in those magic years will always be the foundation of any setlist. As for who should have replaced Alan, whoever took on the role would have faced ill will from fans for Francis's treatment of Alan. I still feel Jim Lea would have been the most palatable replacement for fans coming from a band of equal stature whilst having a playing style vastly different to Alan's. In a way I felt sorry for Rhino being parachuted into a band where his style , his look and his behaviour only antagonized fans. I do think he's grown into his role over the years, though really no matter what he does he will always be viewed by vast numbers of fans as Alan's replacement, just as Pete, Jeff, Matt and Leon will always be John's replacement.
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Post by dennis on Nov 29, 2020 15:20:01 GMT
The reality is that the classic 4 man line up were unequalled at what they did for a few years in the early-mid '70s, very much a case of the band collectively being much more than the sum of it's individual parts - you could still feel a bit of that magic when they were reunited after 30 years. However, it's impossible to remain at that peak of creativity & performance indefinitely, & they had a bloody good run! Even after the addition of Andy they were still producing some good material in the late '70s & remained a fantastic live band, but nothing remains the same forever. People change as individuals, relationships change, & that's even before you get to consider actually replacing individual band members! None of the line ups subsequent to John's departure from the band have generated much by way of recorded output of any note, although there have been a few exceptions along the way - increasingly fewer & farther between. So, they have mainly existed to perform predominantly classic era material live in order to maintain a fan base. Even on the EOTR tour in '84 there was nothing in the set post 1980, the set list was almost a monument to the '70-'80 output of the band - & good stuff it was too! I don't think anybody can replace any of the original members in the full sense of being a creative, contributing member as it's nigh on impossible to recreate that magic that they had together. It's not a case of the quality of musicianship or talent, it's just that certain combinations work for a while & it's hard to recapture the essence of that experience once it's gone. With better management I think the relationships in the band would have been much stronger & the need for line up changes could have been avoided. This sums up the situation perfectly, most classic bands have a classic line up, not necessarily the first line up as with Quo, but the combination of youthful energy and ambition and musical talent combines to create that indefinable magic. Once that line up alters by even one member it's not that the band has ceased to be good, it's just started to evolve along a new musical road, think of the massive change in styles with Purple and Whitesnake within very few years. Status Quo merely underwent the same process but fans of all long lived bands are nostalgic so the songs created in those magic years will always be the foundation of any setlist. As for who should have replaced Alan, whoever took on the role would have faced ill will from fans for Francis's treatment of Alan. I still feel Jim Lea would have been the most palatable replacement for fans coming from a band of equal stature whilst having a playing style vastly different to Alan's. In a way I felt sorry for Rhino being parachuted into a band where his style , his look and his behaviour only antagonized fans. I do think he's grown into his role over the years, though really no matter what he does he will always be viewed by vast numbers of fans as Alan's replacement, just as Pete, Jeff, Matt and Leon will always be John's replacement. It may be sacrilege to say so, but although I like a lot of the Classic era Purple (apart from Child In Time!), my favourite album is Come Taste The Band with Tommy Bolin - which I suspect many might not consider a "proper" Deep Purple album at all. No accounting for taste, or the lack thereof, eh?
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Post by americanquo on Dec 1, 2020 0:29:57 GMT
No one! Alan was Alan. He's one of few bass players I've heard with their own sound, purely from how he plays. His bass lines are pretty unique and creative too. Mystery Song being an example. LOAI, anyone could have came up with it but, the way he plays the notes add so much to the song that, if it was anyone else, the song would become so much less. And that's before we get onto his vocals and stage presence. For better or for worse, Alan feels like one of us. He's a Quo fan! Can't replace that. Can't replace any of them and I'm pretty certain John Edwards and Richie Malone would say the same thing That's just my two cents I agree with all of this. Quo wasn't Quo without its rhythm section, and never could be.
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mortified
4500 Timer
Posts: 5,861
Favourite Quo Album: Hello!
Favourite other bands.: Talking Heads, Rolling Stones, Sheryl Crow, Gary Numan, Alabama 3, ZZ Top, Paul van Dyk, Jeff Beck, Bowie, Gerry Rafferty, Band of Skulls, UFO, S.A.H.B
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Post by mortified on Dec 1, 2020 8:21:21 GMT
Back then (i.e. 1986) I never gave it a single thought. I really didn't. In The Army Now came out after a couple of half decent singles and I loved it. It was way better than 1+9+8+2 and Back To Back and I was happy as a pig in $hit. OK, the album hasn't stood the test of time that well but I'm not dealing with this retrospectively. This is how I felt at the time. I can analyse music like anyone else and put my tuppence worth in but the bottom line is, I generally just sit and listen and I either like it or I don't. I'm not listening to drum fills or snares or bass lines. I'm listening to a track as a whole; as an experience. I may analyse it later the more I listen to it as I start to pick things up. Then again, I might just sit and enjoy it without thinking too much. I guess what I'm trying to say is that the bass and the drums are largely academic to me. I appreciate that they are important to others during the whole listening process and I also appreciate that they have to be there. But I'm obviously more superficial. So shoot me Let's face it, Rhino didn't fit the rock "profile" that many Quo fans identified with. Not then. Probably not even now. But I'd become a right trendy ba$tard by 1986 so I liked it See? Told you. Superficial Alan's replacement - and Pete or Spud's for that matter - didn't concern me. So it could have been anyone. The music, of course, took a downward turn for quite a few years, on and off, but that can't be laid at the feet of anyone in particular. It was getting pretty ropey before Alan left. And he was just as culpable as anyone else. No one likes to see their favourite band split or change, especially a band that has seen you through your teenage years and beyond. But they're people just like the rest of us. They have bust-ups and they have moments of bliss. But a change of personnel or direction isn't personal. They're not doing it to spite me as a fan. Yeah, all very philosophical. I was just chuffed they came back in some form or other and brought out an album that I liked. There wasn't much more to it. I wasn't 16 or even 25 any more. Proper hero worship and idolisation had been left behind. Basically, it was no big deal. But I'm still here so someone must be doing something right. Even the bassist
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Post by blagult on Dec 1, 2020 11:25:42 GMT
Love it Mortified. Couldn’t have put it any better.
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Post by 4th Chord on Dec 1, 2020 11:45:28 GMT
Back then (i.e. 1986) I never gave it a single thought. I really didn't. In The Army Now came out after a couple of half decent singles and I loved it. It was way better than 1+9+8+2 and Back To Back and I was happy as a pig in $hit. OK, the album hasn't stood the test of time that well but I'm not dealing with this retrospectively. This is how I felt at the time. I can analyse music like anyone else and put my tuppence worth in but the bottom line is, I generally just sit and listen and I either like it or I don't. I'm not listening to drum fills or snares or bass lines. I'm listening to a track as a whole; as an experience. I may analyse it later the more I listen to it as I start to pick things up. Then again, I might just sit and enjoy it without thinking too much. I guess what I'm trying to say is that the bass and the drums are largely academic to me. I appreciate that they are important to others during the whole listening process and I also appreciate that they have to be there. But I'm obviously more superficial. So shoot me Let's face it, Rhino didn't fit the rock "profile" that many Quo fans identified with. Not then. Probably not even now. But I'd become a right trendy ba$tard by 1986 so I liked it See? Told you. Superficial Alan's replacement - and Pete or Spud's for that matter - didn't concern me. So it could have been anyone. The music, of course, took a downward turn for quite a few years, on and off, but that can't be laid at the feet of anyone in particular. It was getting pretty ropey before Alan left. And he was just as culpable as anyone else. No one likes to see their favourite band split or change, especially a band that has seen you through your teenage years and beyond. But they're people just like the rest of us. They have bust-ups and they have moments of bliss. But a change of personnel or direction isn't personal. They're not doing it to spite me as a fan. Yeah, all very philosophical. I was just chuffed they came back in some form or other and brought out an album that I liked. There wasn't much more to it. I wasn't 16 or even 25 any more. Proper hero worship and idolisation had been left behind. Basically, it was no big deal. But I'm still here so someone must be doing something right. Even the bassist JUST ANSWER THE QUESTION!
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Post by 4th Chord on Dec 1, 2020 11:50:56 GMT
I think it's fair to say though, that Quo changed. That was a very definite decision to try and stay 'relevant' and keep selling records and tours.
I guess my question was trying to keep it very specific, i.e if Quo had decided to stick with the bias towards their traditional boogie/hard rock/blues/country rock style, but without Alan, who could have stepped in? I do think that the path they followed would have been similar Al or no Al, so it's just a bit of a fantasy discussion.
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mortified
4500 Timer
Posts: 5,861
Favourite Quo Album: Hello!
Favourite other bands.: Talking Heads, Rolling Stones, Sheryl Crow, Gary Numan, Alabama 3, ZZ Top, Paul van Dyk, Jeff Beck, Bowie, Gerry Rafferty, Band of Skulls, UFO, S.A.H.B
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Post by mortified on Dec 1, 2020 13:36:51 GMT
Wasn't Gerry McAvoy a serious consideration? Or is that just one of those myths that tends to gather a bit of steam?
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Post by railroad007 on Dec 1, 2020 14:40:05 GMT
Wasn't Gerry McAvoy a serious consideration? Or is that just one of those myths that tends to gather a bit of steam? I saw him when Nine Below Zero supported Quo at Greenwich in 2010 and they were very good, they pushed Quo who played the best set by the band post 1986 that I've seen.
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Post by fredbloggs on Dec 2, 2020 7:54:18 GMT
In the early 70s, they were all equals; by the mid 80s, Francis & Rick had become the more public face of the band, having sung lead on pretty much all hit singles between them. Ergo they were unlikely to bring in a "big name" bass player at that point. So, if not Rhino, the other "who" would've been somebody else not really known at that time.
All IMHO of course.
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Post by Gaz on Dec 2, 2020 11:20:47 GMT
In the early 70s, they were all equals; by the mid 80s, Francis & Rick had become the more public face of the band, having sung lead on pretty much all hit singles between them. Ergo they were unlikely to bring in a "big name" bass player at that point. So, if not Rhino, the other "who" would've been somebody else not really known at that time. All IMHO of course. Maybe why they hired that weird stiff looking guy on the RAOTW video... did the job but zero character.
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