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Post by twentytwenty on Dec 21, 2020 14:09:23 GMT
I just ask myself How did Rossi get it so wrong? Cheers I understand your view, because I've wondered the same myself. But what if he wasn't being himself in those early days? Yes he enjoyed blues/shuffles but he wanted to be one of Everly Bros, sing pop songs. What if he simply couldn't keep up the pretence any more? I'm simply grateful that we had those years that I love so much. I would say that he's always been himself, he has always written poppy country tunes even in the "glorious 70s"; Invitation was written around if you can't stand the heat period. Claudie. etc.. The only thing that sets songs like Claudie apart from songs like Adress book etc is the production and Coghlan, other than that it's the same kind of songs
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Post by Mrs Flittersnoop on Dec 21, 2020 14:15:50 GMT
I think Curious Girl has nailed it really. My guess is that he DID enjoy playing moody shuffles and heavy duty rock when he was confident and in a good mood but he never really identified with the rock thing, so he moved on. There was such a thing as the Quo Sound (as twentytwenty implies), it's not just production, or John, and that was what went out of the window in the mid 80s. The only things wrong with ITAN album for example were the lack of that sound, and nothing rocky in the class of BFM or Mystery Song. So near and yet sooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo far.
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Post by twentytwenty on Dec 21, 2020 14:25:47 GMT
I think Curious Girl has nailed it really. My guess is that he DID enjoy playing moody shuffles and heavy duty rock when he was confident and in a good mood but he never really identified with the rock thing, so he moved on. There was such a thing as the Quo Sound (as twentytwenty implies), it's not just production, or John, and that was what went out of the window in the mid 80s. The only things wrong with ITAN album for example were the lack of that sound, and nothing rocky in the class of BFM or Mystery Song. So near and yet sooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo far. I mean, listen to the album version of Invitation, and then the demo from If you can't stand the heat. They play exactly the same, but the older one sound more QUO than the newer one. And that's mainly because of the production and that John had a different feeling in his playing I would say that one of the biggest difference between the original line up vs the newer ones is that the rhythm section by Coghlan/Lancaster was more sloppy which made those kind of songs more alive than the work of Rich/Edwards that's more clinical.
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Post by The Lord Flasheart on Dec 21, 2020 19:17:54 GMT
Afraid David Walker was the problem, They were at least trying something new/current with ITAN and Ain't Complaining even if it didn't work. When DW came along in 1989 he pulled the plug on any further promotion of Perfect Remedy.
Yes it's not a very good album but I still think there was milage in The Power Of Rock as a single. When I have played that to non Quo fans some say that's not a bad track. So we enter the DW years with Aniversary Waltz, yes that does work only because it was fashionable. RTYD good idea but after that the ideas became dafter, suing Radio One etc.
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Post by azza200 on Dec 22, 2020 9:14:39 GMT
They sure did take the light entertainment showbiz route in the 90's which made them lose their rock credibility Would it not be fair to say they lost most of their Rock credibility in 1977 ? Out of 7 albums released after BFY as the FF or most of the FF only 2 had any credibility as Rock Music. Maybe even just WYW as I’m including NTL Loosely. Love that album justfor the record ! I wouldnt say they did after 77 as they were still putting on live shows which kept their rock credibility to some extent imo. The 80's David Walker era they became so showbiz is when they became a panto light entertainment band to a degree image wise. Francis & Rick appearing on every tv show every other week playback performances the gimmicks they did during that period. Live shows different too the showbiz side but the odd few who like the "showbiz image" of Quo may not of liked the heavier rock Quo
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Post by blagult on Dec 22, 2020 12:40:42 GMT
I see what your saying publicity wise & live. I was just purely coming from the music they were releasing.
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Post by frozenhero on Dec 22, 2020 21:22:55 GMT
They sure did take the light entertainment showbiz route in the 90's which made them lose their rock credibility Would it not be fair to say they lost most of their Rock credibility in 1977 ? Out of 7 albums released after BFY as the FF or most of the FF only 2 had any credibility as Rock Music. Maybe even just WYW as I’m including NTL Loosely. Love that album justfor the record ! Sorry but if you play any of those albums to my pop friend or my jazz dad, I'm sure they'll all class it as "rock music". I mean, Just Supposin' has Don't Drive My Car, Coming and Going and Over the Edge. It may be lighter, some poppier tracks may be creepin' in (not that Quo didn't have that from the beginning) but it's still rock. Back to Back is the first album I'd be somewhat cautious about calling it rock. I also don't think this concept of losing most of their credibility in 1977 is supported by press or fan coverage of the era. Especially given they didn't let up live (though I guess the long break between 1979 and 1981 did take some steam out of the band). I just ask myself How did Rossi get it so wrong? Cheers I understand your view, because I've wondered the same myself. But what if he wasn't being himself in those early days? Yes he enjoyed blues/shuffles but he wanted to be one of Everly Bros, sing pop songs. What if he simply couldn't keep up the pretence any more? I'm simply grateful that we had those years that I love so much. People change, experiment, tastes change, evolve. I'm just listening to some early Genesis - these days Mike Rutherford says he'd rather write a short pop song than a gigantic prog track, but he's not disowning his past. Those early band years are often a period the band themselves looks back on as being inexperienced, naive, whatever - to fans and critics, they often constitute the real magic exactly because the bands weren't too sure what they were doing and just stumbling onto something great. Afraid David Walker was the problem, They were at least trying something new/current with ITAN and Ain't Complaining even if it didn't work. When DW came along in 1989 he pulled the plug on any further promotion of Perfect Remedy. Yes it's not a very good album but I still think there was milage in The Power Of Rock as a single. When I have played that to non Quo fans some say that's not a bad track. So we enter the DW years with Aniversary Waltz, yes that does work only because it was fashionable. RTYD good idea but after that the ideas became dafter, suing Radio One etc. Anniversary Waltz had great production - sort of a RTYD preview - and showed the live power of the "new" line-up. But then doing all the covers albums was definitely a step too far. I do agree that The Power of Rock 7" should've been properly released and promoted.
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Post by townsvillequo on Jan 18, 2021 22:23:24 GMT
Think Francis is an all rounder when it comes to writing and making music. As at home making Rock as he is at making Country or Pop. Don't quite buy the view that he wasn't being himself when making Quo albums, and that since Margie Time days he began being himself. Do think he became more sure of himself into the 80's enough to put his softest styles out to the established fans. Only problem there fans were somewhat less accepting compared to his earlier work.
In a way brought about by AL not being there to keep Quo's music on its previous path.
And so began a divide of Quo fans.
So imagine FR going back to AL and saying - listen AL in hindsight I'am sorry as your ideas for Quo's music were less dividing of fans. Imagine that? Nope it would never happen.
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Post by azza200 on Jan 18, 2021 23:13:34 GMT
That post makes a lot of sense and is also like what happened in Pink Floyd after Roger quit and David Nick and Rick released two albums and 2 successful tours. Of course the material is different too what came before in their peak when Roger was around. There is a divide in the fanbase which is generally the Roger fanatic's who are extremely toxic of the David era his style of PF and music as well as attacking his wife, even though he has stated lyrics are his weakness over the years many times. (Some name examples Pink Fraud, Pink Floyd lite, Polly Floyd)
David and Francis have different styles of music they put out fair enough. Alan & Roger Waters are a-like and is where both the fanbase's are divided by those eras some like SQ with the classic line up pre 1986. Pink Floyd with Roger Waters, some like both and avoid the arguments. But both eras post Alan & Post Roger Waters draw new fans too the band's it did for me with Quo and PF. Both bands started their new line up's within a year of each other too.
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Post by freewilly on Jan 18, 2021 23:50:42 GMT
Can't speak for anyone else...
But, from my perspective, my issue with stuff like Address Book, Tommy, 1000 years, majority of Thirsty Work, his stuff on Bula Quo, the Acoustic stuff is not that they're country or a different genre to the usual Quo stuff...My issue is, they're not very good songs or arrangements. There is nothing in them. They're bland and soulless. Other songs that are good, they're terribly produced and performed very lazily or half arsed
Take Tango for example...That has all the potential in the world to be fucking great. Fantastic guitar on that track! Yet, it just seems like another throwaway. Maybe it's the performances on the track that does that or the absolute horrible middle 8th in there, I don't know...Same with Like it or not. That is a more traditional Quo tune and yet has a different slant on it by being in a minor key and guitar that involves the harmonic minor. Brilliant guitar work on it but, it just feels and seems flat. They're both good songs but, the production and performances don't do them justice. Vocals are lazy as hell
I love Invitation, Rearrange, Fine Fine Fine, Claudie, Someone Show Me Home...Absolutely brilliant! If he produced songs like that and they were recorded well, I'd have loved it. It's not about the Quo shuffle or sound, it's about the quality. A Year, for example, it's hardly a hard rock song. It's soppy as fuck! Yet, it's brilliant and written by the alleged Macho Man Randy Savage (Alan)
Problem is, for every FFF or SSMH, there's about 10 Looking For Carolines
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Post by twentytwenty on Jan 19, 2021 4:31:10 GMT
Can't speak for anyone else... But, from my perspective, my issue with stuff like Address Book, Tommy, 1000 years, majority of Thirsty Work, his stuff on Bula Quo, the Acoustic stuff is not that they're country or a different genre to the usual Quo stuff...My issue is, they're not very good songs or arrangements. There is nothing in them. They're bland and soulless. Other songs that are good, they're terribly produced and performed very lazily or half arsed Take Tango for example...That has all the potential in the world to be fucking great. Fantastic guitar on that track! Yet, it just seems like another throwaway. Maybe it's the performances on the track that does that or the absolute horrible middle 8th in there, I don't know...Same with Like it or not. That is a more traditional Quo tune and yet has a different slant on it by being in a minor key and guitar that involves the harmonic minor. Brilliant guitar work on it but, it just feels and seems flat. They're both good songs but, the production and performances don't do them justice. Vocals are lazy as hell I love Invitation, Rearrange, Fine Fine Fine, Claudie, Someone Show Me Home...Absolutely brilliant! If he produced songs like that and they were recorded well, I'd have loved it. It's not about the Quo shuffle or sound, it's about the quality. A Year, for example, it's hardly a hard rock song. It's soppy as fuck! Yet, it's brilliant and written by the alleged Macho Man Randy Savage (Alan) Problem is, for every FFF or SSMH, there's about 10 Looking For Carolines I like Looking out for Caroline, bula Quo song, adress book and majority of thirsty work. Looking out for Caroline and bula Quo song is hella catchy
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mortified
4500 Timer
Posts: 5,771
Favourite Quo Album: Hello!
Favourite other bands.: Sheryl Crow, Gary Numan, Alabama 3, ZZ Top, Paul van Dyk, Jeff Beck, Bowie, Gerry Rafferty, Band of Skulls, UFO, S.A.H.B
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Post by mortified on Jan 19, 2021 7:37:42 GMT
Can't speak for anyone else... But, from my perspective, my issue with stuff like Address Book, Tommy, 1000 years, majority of Thirsty Work, his stuff on Bula Quo, the Acoustic stuff is not that they're country or a different genre to the usual Quo stuff...My issue is, they're not very good songs or arrangements. There is nothing in them. They're bland and soulless. Other songs that are good, they're terribly produced and performed very lazily or half arsed Take Tango for example...That has all the potential in the world to be fucking great. Fantastic guitar on that track! Yet, it just seems like another throwaway. Maybe it's the performances on the track that does that or the absolute horrible middle 8th in there, I don't know...Same with Like it or not. That is a more traditional Quo tune and yet has a different slant on it by being in a minor key and guitar that involves the harmonic minor. Brilliant guitar work on it but, it just feels and seems flat. They're both good songs but, the production and performances don't do them justice. Vocals are lazy as hell I love Invitation, Rearrange, Fine Fine Fine, Claudie, Someone Show Me Home...Absolutely brilliant! If he produced songs like that and they were recorded well, I'd have loved it. It's not about the Quo shuffle or sound, it's about the quality. A Year, for example, it's hardly a hard rock song. It's soppy as fuck! Yet, it's brilliant and written by the alleged Macho Man Randy Savage (Alan) Problem is, for every FFF or SSMH, there's about 10 Looking For Carolines I don't agree 100% with all of that but I do with a lot of it. I'm a big fan of the Aquostic stuff and most of the Bula Quo album. Funnily enough, Looking Out For Caroline is one that I tend to skip. Tango I cannot stand. It's one of my all time dislike Quo tracks. But maybe you've explained why. I take a certain comfort in that. I don't like disliking Quo tracks. It feels disloyal I also prefer Francis's solo version of Someone Show Me Home for some reason. No idea why.
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Post by charles on Jan 19, 2021 7:41:10 GMT
2020 I like Looking out for Caroline, bula Quo song, adress book and majority of thirsty work. Looking out for Caroline and bula Quo song is hella catchy So was the plague.
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Post by frozenhero on Jan 19, 2021 18:18:55 GMT
Can't speak for anyone else... But, from my perspective, my issue with stuff like Address Book, Tommy, 1000 years, majority of Thirsty Work, his stuff on Bula Quo, the Acoustic stuff is not that they're country or a different genre to the usual Quo stuff...My issue is, they're not very good songs or arrangements. There is nothing in them. They're bland and soulless. Other songs that are good, they're terribly produced and performed very lazily or half arsed To a degree it is. Perfect Remedy had the potential to be a good return to form after two more technical and 80s sounding albums. But then those songs start coming up and they just do. not. fit. Of course Marguerita Time and Address Book are closely related to each other. But that doesn't really invalidate my argument since Alan was already of the opinion that MT wasn't right for the band. I can't argue with that. Take Tango for example...That has all the potential in the world to be fucking great. Fantastic guitar on that track! Yet, it just seems like another throwaway. Maybe it's the performances on the track that does that or the absolute horrible middle 8th in there, I don't know...Same with Like it or not. That is a more traditional Quo tune and yet has a different slant on it by being in a minor key and guitar that involves the harmonic minor. Brilliant guitar work on it but, it just feels and seems flat. They're both good songs but, the production and performances don't do them justice. Vocals are lazy as hell But having a song called Tango and then not having a part that you can actually tango to would be kinda pointless, wouldn't it? I wondered why Like It Or Not was never tried out live. I think it has to do with the amount of lyrics. This has never been discussed much AFAIK but Francis' songs have tended to get really wordy at times, and I bet that it must be hellish to remember all that stuff live.
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Post by freewilly on Jan 19, 2021 19:49:30 GMT
Can't speak for anyone else... But, from my perspective, my issue with stuff like Address Book, Tommy, 1000 years, majority of Thirsty Work, his stuff on Bula Quo, the Acoustic stuff is not that they're country or a different genre to the usual Quo stuff...My issue is, they're not very good songs or arrangements. There is nothing in them. They're bland and soulless. Other songs that are good, they're terribly produced and performed very lazily or half arsed To a degree it is. Perfect Remedy had the potential to be a good return to form after two more technical and 80s sounding albums. But then those songs start coming up and they just do. not. fit. Of course Marguerita Time and Address Book are closely related to each other. But that doesn't really invalidate my argument since Alan was already of the opinion that MT wasn't right for the band. I can't argue with that. Take Tango for example...That has all the potential in the world to be fucking great. Fantastic guitar on that track! Yet, it just seems like another throwaway. Maybe it's the performances on the track that does that or the absolute horrible middle 8th in there, I don't know...Same with Like it or not. That is a more traditional Quo tune and yet has a different slant on it by being in a minor key and guitar that involves the harmonic minor. Brilliant guitar work on it but, it just feels and seems flat. They're both good songs but, the production and performances don't do them justice. Vocals are lazy as hell But having a song called Tango and then not having a part that you can actually tango to would be kinda pointless, wouldn't it? I wondered why Like It Or Not was never tried out live. I think it has to do with the amount of lyrics. This has never been discussed much AFAIK but Francis' songs have tended to get really wordy at times, and I bet that it must be hellish to remember all that stuff live. To elaborate further on my performed lazily point... Listen to Rhino's bass work on the Army and AC albums...Compare it to his playing on PR and majority of TW. It's like two different bass players. On Army and AC, it was fresh, different and added something to the songs...On PR and TW (minus Lover of The Human Race) it sounds like he's either been told to keep it simple or he just thought, "Meh, that'll do" Same with Francis' vocals...Some tracks he just sounds like "let's just get this over with" Tango...The guitar work is fantastic and the idea is great. Middle 8th though, fuck me
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